|
Home > Archive > Other Oracle database topics > November 2005 > Oracle costs and requirements
You are viewing an archived Text-only version of the thread.
To view this thread in it's original format and/or if you want to reply to
this thread please [click here]
| Author |
Oracle costs and requirements
|
|
| Matt Bailey 2005-11-24, 1:23 pm |
| Hi,
I risk sounding like an idiot here, but I'm a database newbie and I
don't know the first thing about Oracle - not a jot!
I'm currently doing a University assignment that requires me to cost
out an Oracle database for a company, along with all its trimmings,
but I've been unable to find any information on the web.
It's a small company and its data requirements are very small. I'm
wondering if anyone here can help me out with my estimation. I need to
know:
A. What's required for an Oracle database?
So far I'm assuming:
A server (any particular kind?)
The Oracle 10g software
An Oracle license (don't have a clue about this)
but is there anything else?
B. How much does all this stuff cost?
I hope someone's got some advice, cause I'm a bit clueless at the
minute. Cheers,
Matt
| |
| DA Morgan 2005-11-24, 8:23 pm |
| Matt Bailey wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I risk sounding like an idiot here, but I'm a database newbie and I
> don't know the first thing about Oracle - not a jot!
>
> I'm currently doing a University assignment that requires me to cost
> out an Oracle database for a company, along with all its trimmings,
> but I've been unable to find any information on the web.
http://store.oracle.com will give you list prices which, in reality,
are near meaningless except as a starting point for discussions.
> It's a small company and its data requirements are very small. I'm
> wondering if anyone here can help me out with my estimation. I need to
> know:
>
> A. What's required for an Oracle database?
>
> So far I'm assuming:
>
> A server (any particular kind?)
Depends? OLTP? OLAP? What transaction volume? What size transactions?
What data? How many simultaneous users?
> The Oracle 10g software
This question gets you down to a list of say 100 or so products. What
Oracle software? Just in databases alone Oracle sells Enterprise
Edition, Standard Edition, SE1, a few more variants, TimesTen, and Rdb.
> An Oracle license (don't have a clue about this)
Neither will anyone else given the sparsity of what you've posted.
> but is there anything else?
A huge amount. Your professor should be ashamed to have put you up
to this with so little background. And if you would like to refer that
person to me I would be happy to explain it to them. This is an
assignment that has little value except if the point is to prove that
you don't know as much as you should to do this properly.
> B. How much does all this stuff cost?
Depends on numerous factors.
> I hope someone's got some advice, cause I'm a bit clueless at the
> minute. Cheers,
>
> Matt
I wonder whether your professor is too? I'd suggest you go back and
ask for clarification on the assignment.
For example ... what is the Service Level Agreement with the system's
users? Does it need to support a 7x24 web site? Does it need to be able
to failover to a secondary data center?
If the point is just to throw some garbage together and claim success
then I'd suggest yougo to store.oracle.com and price out a minimum
license on Oracle SE1, load it on WhiteBox Linux on the least expensive
Dell or Gateway box you can find, perhaps 2.8MHz with a gig of RAM and
declare success.
--
Daniel A. Morgan
http://www.psoug.org
damorgan@x.washington.edu
(replace x with u to respond)
| |
|
| Hi Matt!
You can get an Oracle-db for 0$ -legal (-:
http://www.oracle.com/technology/so...e/xe/index.html
/Bjørn
"Matt Bailey" <mattb947@hotmail.co.uk> skrev i en meddelelse
news:nm4co15mqivaqa1
qsejbuh9534mu9higec@
4ax.com...
> Hi,
>
> I risk sounding like an idiot here, but I'm a database newbie and I
> don't know the first thing about Oracle - not a jot!
>
> I'm currently doing a University assignment that requires me to cost
> out an Oracle database for a company, along with all its trimmings,
> but I've been unable to find any information on the web.
>
> It's a small company and its data requirements are very small. I'm
> wondering if anyone here can help me out with my estimation. I need to
> know:
>
> A. What's required for an Oracle database?
>
> So far I'm assuming:
>
> A server (any particular kind?)
> The Oracle 10g software
> An Oracle license (don't have a clue about this)
>
> but is there anything else?
>
>
> B. How much does all this stuff cost?
>
>
> I hope someone's got some advice, cause I'm a bit clueless at the
> minute. Cheers,
>
> Matt
| |
| Mark Townsend 2005-11-24, 8:23 pm |
| Matt Bailey wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I risk sounding like an idiot here, but I'm a database newbie and I
> don't know the first thing about Oracle - not a jot!
Welcome to Oracle
> I'm currently doing a University assignment that requires me to cost
> out an Oracle database for a company, along with all its trimmings,
> but I've been unable to find any information on the web.
>
> It's a small company and its data requirements are very small. I'm
> wondering if anyone here can help me out with my estimation. I need to
> know:
>
> A. What's required for an Oracle database?
>
> So far I'm assuming:
>
> A server (any particular kind?)
Pretty much any kind you want. Oracle runs on nearly all hardware and/or
operating systems. Popular platforms are Windows, Linux, and Unix
> The Oracle 10g software
There are 5 editions of the Oracle Database Software
Oracle Enterprise Edition - for high end, mission critical transaction
processing and data warehousing environments.
Oracle Standard Edition - for small to medium businesses, on machines up
to 4 CPUs in size
Oracle Standard Edition One - for small to medium businesses, on
machines up to 2 CPUs in size
Oracle Personal Edition - for single user environments
Each of these is based on the same code line, so applications developed
for one can be easily migrated to a 'stronger' edition.
There is also the new Express Edition - see below
> An Oracle license (don't have a clue about this)
Each (esxcept for the Express Edition) is licensable. The prices are
published on store.oracle.com, but range from $149 per user, all the way
up to $40,000 per CPU
There are also additional options available with the Enterprise Edition
that addresses key requirements in the enterprise - such as advanced
security, real application clustering, data partitioning etc. These are
again priced seperately
>
> but is there anything else?
>
Oracle also has a new starter edition out in beta, called Express
Edition. This is 100% free for use, but has some limits in terms of the
amount of CPU it will use, data it will hold etc. It is also very quick
to download and install, and you can literally have your first
application up and developed within a minute of install. If you want to
kick the tires of Oracle, I would recommend it
>
> B. How much does all this stuff cost?
Without being facteious, pretty much as much as you want to spend. You
can start with Oracle for free, or, as a large corporation, literlally
spend millions
>
> I hope someone's got some advice, cause I'm a bit clueless at the
> minute. Cheers,
Go to otn.oracle.com This is a free site, but you will have to register.
Specifically have a look at the content starting from the database home
page -
http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...e10g/index.html
Specific information on
Enterprise Edition -
http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...gR2_EE_0605.pdf
Standard Edition -
http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...gR2_SE_0605.pdf
Standard Edition One -
http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...0605
.pdf
Express Edition -
http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...e/xe/index.html
And last but not least, I do work for Oracle, so feel free to ask any
questions you have.
> Matt
| |
|
| On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 19:22:41 +0000, Matt Bailey wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I risk sounding like an idiot here, but I'm a database newbie and I
> don't know the first thing about Oracle - not a jot!
>
> I'm currently doing a University assignment that requires me to cost
> out an Oracle database for a company, along with all its trimmings,
> but I've been unable to find any information on the web.
>
> It's a small company and its data requirements are very small. I'm
> wondering if anyone here can help me out with my estimation. I need to
> know:
>
> A. What's required for an Oracle database?
>
> So far I'm assuming:
>
> A server (any particular kind?)
> The Oracle 10g software
> An Oracle license (don't have a clue about this)
>
> but is there anything else?
>
That's sufficient for holding the data. How 'bout managing, manipulating,
updating and archiving the data? Generally you'd starting thing about the
actual application and the environment - for example, ow do you plan for
long-term backups?
>
> B. How much does all this stuff cost?
>
Depends.
If the result will fit on a single CPU, 1GBRAM, 4GB data environment using
Linux or Windows, you could use ORacle Database E10g Release 2 Express
Edition entirely for 'no fee'. Catch is - like 'free and open source
software', you gotta look for support.
Otherwise go to http://store.oracle.com and see the list prices. It's
damned expensive if you don't take advantage of the capabilities - and
many novice developers don't know enough to take advantage of those
capabilities. If you do take advantage, though, it will give just about
the best ROI of any rdbms, including open source.
A smart architect will separate the database machine from the application
services. If you buy licenses, it's by CPU or by 'end-user human'.
Plunking the app and the database stuff on the same machine will require
more CPU and you gotta pay for all the CPU on the machine, even if 1/2 the
CPU are being used by stuff other than Oracle.
Oracle's a BIG subject. Get involved in a local Oraqcle Users Group (see
http://www.oracle.com and search in the About Oracle area for official
OUGs). It's not your baby brother's Access upgraded - hire a consultant,
take training or buy http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/oressentials3/ and
http://apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=10008
--
Hans Forbrich
Canada-wide Oracle training and consulting
mailto: Fuzzy.GreyBeard_at_gmail.com
*** Top posting replies guarantees I won't respond. ***
| |
| Matt Bailey 2005-11-24, 8:23 pm |
| On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 12:01:09 -0800, DA Morgan <damorgan@psoug.org>
wrote:
>
>http://store.oracle.com will give you list prices which, in reality,
>are near meaningless except as a starting point for discussions.
>
DA, thanks for the reply. Made me laugh in places :-)
I agree that it's a bit of a pants assignment. To be fair though, I
didn't give the whole picture. The costings are not the whole
assignment - just a small part of a bigger assignment.
The assignment is to implement a thick client and a thin client (web
based) interface to a database for a fictional scenario (your choice
of development technology and scenario) and to evaluate each
development approach. The costing bit was tagged on to the end.
Pasting:
--------------------------
Include a section costing out your two solutions stating any
assumptions. Assume for example :-
(i) The Oracle site-licence fee and database server overheads are
shared equally between your application and 3 others.
(ii) The hourly cost for a Database designer/engineer/tester is
£90.
(iii) Include the first year of maintenance assuming 2 new tables
will be added and 3 new screens designed and implemented.
The estimate need only be approximate but try to include all relevant
expenses (assume the client-PCs and network have already been
purchased and installed).
--------------------------
Since the cost predictions are based on my own scenario (a chain of
Fitness Centres) the answers to your questions are pretty much down to
my own envisaging of the fictional company. So there are no fixed
requirements for the costing exercise - it's really what I decide
myself.
>
>If the point is just to throw some garbage together and claim success
>then I'd suggest yougo to store.oracle.com and price out a minimum
>license on Oracle SE1, load it on WhiteBox Linux on the least expensive
>Dell or Gateway box you can find, perhaps 2.8MHz with a gig of RAM and
>declare success.
Well, ideally I'd like to make it as realistic an estimate as
possible, so I'll do some further investigating, but failing that,
this looks like a good option!
Matt
| |
| Matt Bailey 2005-11-24, 8:23 pm |
| On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 12:10:08 -0800, Mark Townsend
< markbtownsend@comcas
t.net> wrote:
[color=darkred]
>Matt Bailey wrote:
>
>Welcome to Oracle
>
>
>Pretty much any kind you want. Oracle runs on nearly all hardware and/or
>operating systems. Popular platforms are Windows, Linux, and Unix
>
>
>There are 5 editions of the Oracle Database Software
>
>Oracle Enterprise Edition - for high end, mission critical transaction
>processing and data warehousing environments.
>
>Oracle Standard Edition - for small to medium businesses, on machines up
>to 4 CPUs in size
>
>Oracle Standard Edition One - for small to medium businesses, on
>machines up to 2 CPUs in size
>
>Oracle Personal Edition - for single user environments
>
>Each of these is based on the same code line, so applications developed
>for one can be easily migrated to a 'stronger' edition.
>
>There is also the new Express Edition - see below
>
>
>Each (esxcept for the Express Edition) is licensable. The prices are
>published on store.oracle.com, but range from $149 per user, all the way
>up to $40,000 per CPU
>
>There are also additional options available with the Enterprise Edition
>that addresses key requirements in the enterprise - such as advanced
>security, real application clustering, data partitioning etc. These are
>again priced seperately
>
>
>
>Oracle also has a new starter edition out in beta, called Express
>Edition. This is 100% free for use, but has some limits in terms of the
>amount of CPU it will use, data it will hold etc. It is also very quick
>to download and install, and you can literally have your first
>application up and developed within a minute of install. If you want to
>kick the tires of Oracle, I would recommend it
>
>
>Without being facteious, pretty much as much as you want to spend. You
>can start with Oracle for free, or, as a large corporation, literlally
>spend millions
>
>
>Go to otn.oracle.com This is a free site, but you will have to register.
>Specifically have a look at the content starting from the database home
>page -
>http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...e10g/index.html
>
>Specific information on
>Enterprise Edition -
>http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...gR2_EE_0605.pdf
>Standard Edition -
>http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...gR2_SE_0605.pdf
>Standard Edition One -
>http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...0605
.pdf
>
>Express Edition -
>http://www.oracle.com/technology/pr...e/xe/index.html
>
>And last but not least, I do work for Oracle, so feel free to ask any
>questions you have.
>
Mark - that's really useful and has answered several questions that
have been going round in my mind.
I will definitely check out the free Express Edition. I'm keen to get
some real hands-on experience with Oracle, so that should come in
nicely.
Thanks a bunch for the info.
Matt
| |
| Matt Bailey 2005-11-24, 8:23 pm |
| On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 21:15:36 GMT, HansF <News.Hans@telus.net> wrote:
>On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 19:22:41 +0000, Matt Bailey wrote:
>
>
>That's sufficient for holding the data. How 'bout managing, manipulating,
>updating and archiving the data? Generally you'd starting thing about the
>actual application and the environment - for example, ow do you plan for
>long-term backups?
>
Thanks for the reply.
I haven't considered back-ups or data administration, but you're right
- it should all be part of the cost estimation. Do you have any links
that could give information about what might be need to be costed out
for data back-up provisions?
Matt
| |
|
|
| DA Morgan 2005-11-25, 1:23 pm |
| Matt Bailey wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 12:01:09 -0800, DA Morgan <damorgan@psoug.org>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> DA, thanks for the reply. Made me laugh in places :-)
Stop! You're going to ruin my reputation.
> I agree that it's a bit of a pants assignment. To be fair though, I
> didn't give the whole picture. The costings are not the whole
> assignment - just a small part of a bigger assignment.
And this makes it better or worse? ;-)
> The assignment is to implement a thick client and a thin client (web
> based) interface to a database for a fictional scenario (your choice
> of development technology and scenario) and to evaluate each
> development approach. The costing bit was tagged on to the end.
So you need to provide 7x24 service which means RAC in the data center
and likely a second remote data center, also with a RAC cluster and
using DataGuard for failover. So now we are talking Enterprise Edition.
Price out 8 CPU licenses. 2x2 node cluster at the primary data center
and 2x2 node cluster at the remote site.
Instead of figuring in the cost of power conditioning, dielsel
generators, etc. assume you have an ASP hosting it for you. You
can get pricing from www.bluegecko.net or others.
> Pasting:
>
> --------------------------
> Include a section costing out your two solutions stating any
> assumptions. Assume for example :-
> (i) The Oracle site-licence fee and database server overheads are
> shared equally between your application and 3 others.
Divide by 4?
> (ii) The hourly cost for a Database designer/engineer/tester is
> £90.
So the competency and web surfing habits have to be considered? ;-)
> (iii) Include the first year of maintenance assuming 2 new tables
> will be added and 3 new screens designed and implemented.
Pick any number you wish as adding 2 tables takes less than 1 second.
Creating 3 screens can take 1 hour to 1 year.
> The estimate need only be approximate but try to include all relevant
> expenses (assume the client-PCs and network have already been
> purchased and installed).
> --------------------------
I hope you have a year to produce this.
> Since the cost predictions are based on my own scenario (a chain of
> Fitness Centres) the answers to your questions are pretty much down to
> my own envisaging of the fictional company. So there are no fixed
> requirements for the costing exercise - it's really what I decide
> myself.
Given you are in the European Union I presume you will make sure all
is in compliance with Basel II.
>
> Well, ideally I'd like to make it as realistic an estimate as
> possible, so I'll do some further investigating, but failing that,
> this looks like a good option!
>
> Matt
I still question your professor's sanity unless you have 3 months or
more to do this. But have a whack at it and don't forget to purchase
a maintenance agreement on your hardware.
--
Daniel A. Morgan
http://www.psoug.org
damorgan@x.washington.edu
(replace x with u to respond)
| |
| Frank van Bortel 2005-11-26, 9:23 am |
| DA Morgan wrote:
> Matt Bailey wrote:
>
>
>
> Stop! You're going to ruin my reputation.
>
>
>
> And this makes it better or worse? ;-)
>
>
>
> So you need to provide 7x24 service which means RAC in the data center
> and likely a second remote data center, also with a RAC cluster and
> using DataGuard for failover. So now we are talking Enterprise Edition.
> Price out 8 CPU licenses. 2x2 node cluster at the primary data center
> and 2x2 node cluster at the remote site.
>
> Instead of figuring in the cost of power conditioning, dielsel
> generators, etc. assume you have an ASP hosting it for you. You
> can get pricing from www.bluegecko.net or others.
>
>
>
> Divide by 4?
>
>
>
> So the competency and web surfing habits have to be considered? ;-)
>
>
>
> Pick any number you wish as adding 2 tables takes less than 1 second.
> Creating 3 screens can take 1 hour to 1 year.
>
>
>
> I hope you have a year to produce this.
>
>
>
> Given you are in the European Union I presume you will make sure all
> is in compliance with Basel II.
>
>
>
> I still question your professor's sanity unless you have 3 months or
> more to do this. But have a whack at it and don't forget to purchase
> a maintenance agreement on your hardware.
I could run it in service.
--
Regards,
Frank van Bortel
Top-posting is one way to shut me up...
| |
| DA Morgan 2005-11-26, 1:23 pm |
| Frank van Bortel wrote:
> DA Morgan wrote:
>
>
>
> I could run it in service.
And if he contacted an ASP, such as bluegecko.net, they would provide
the hardware, the DBA, the SysAdmin, etc. for just a few thousand a
month making the entire process of researching the paper basically a
single email. But then, while fulfilling his professor's request with
precision ... would likely get a really bad grade.
--
Daniel A. Morgan
http://www.psoug.org
damorgan@x.washington.edu
(replace x with u to respond)
| |
| Frank van Bortel 2005-11-26, 1:23 pm |
| DA Morgan wrote:
> Frank van Bortel wrote:
>
& #91;snip][color=dark
red]
>
>
> And if he contacted an ASP, such as bluegecko.net, they would provide
> the hardware, the DBA, the SysAdmin, etc. for just a few thousand a
> month making the entire process of researching the paper basically a
> single email. But then, while fulfilling his professor's request with
> precision ... would likely get a really bad grade.
Realistically, I'd outsource it, or I'd run it on
XE/Linux, or XE/Windows, depending on what
the shop already has (Windows or Unix expertise).
The shop is small, and the data demand is small.
A server would be any Intel based machine (less than 500 Euro),
preferably with some kind of storage box (RAID/JBOD) attached,
cost: approx 1500 Euro (RAID0/1/5; 4*450MB drives)
As this is a new design/application, I'd make it web enabled.
JDeveloper, and HTMLDB come to mind; JDeveloper if you insist
on J2EE/JSF/ADF (which really boosts your development performance!),
but probably requires an extra machine as web- and applicationserver.
If you keep the amount of hits small (1 million hits/month or less);
HTMLDB will do. Adding two tables and three screens will be a matter
of days; two, three at the most. HTMLDB is really easy, but delivers
pure HTML - maybe not sexy enough for a chain of Fitness centres.
--
Regards,
Frank van Bortel
Top-posting is one way to shut me up...
| |
| DA Morgan 2005-11-26, 8:24 pm |
| Frank van Bortel wrote:
> DA Morgan wrote:
>
>
> [snip]
>
>
>
> Realistically, I'd outsource it, or I'd run it on
> XE/Linux, or XE/Windows, depending on what
> the shop already has (Windows or Unix expertise).
>
> The shop is small, and the data demand is small.
> A server would be any Intel based machine (less than 500 Euro),
> preferably with some kind of storage box (RAID/JBOD) attached,
> cost: approx 1500 Euro (RAID0/1/5; 4*450MB drives)
>
> As this is a new design/application, I'd make it web enabled.
> JDeveloper, and HTMLDB come to mind; JDeveloper if you insist
> on J2EE/JSF/ADF (which really boosts your development performance!),
> but probably requires an extra machine as web- and applicationserver.
> If you keep the amount of hits small (1 million hits/month or less);
> HTMLDB will do. Adding two tables and three screens will be a matter
> of days; two, three at the most. HTMLDB is really easy, but delivers
> pure HTML - maybe not sexy enough for a chain of Fitness centres.
Lets get him a quote. You quote on the development and I'll quote
on the hosting. ;-)
Think he'll pay in Chimay?
--
Daniel A. Morgan
http://www.psoug.org
damorgan@x.washington.edu
(replace x with u to respond)
| |
| Frank van Bortel 2005-11-27, 7:23 am |
| DA Morgan wrote:
> Frank van Bortel wrote:
>
>
>
> Lets get him a quote. You quote on the development and I'll quote
> on the hosting. ;-)
>
> Think he'll pay in Chimay?
If he does, he's on!
--
Regards,
Frank van Bortel
Top-posting is one way to shut me up...
|
|
|
|
|