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Home > Archive > ASE Database forum > October 2005 > ASE 15 can access data in files?
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ASE 15 can access data in files?
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| Michael Heaney 2005-09-27, 8:24 pm |
| eWeek has a story about ASE 15 in the 9/12/2005 edition, entitled
"Latest Sybase ASE grows up". Towards the end is this: "The database
offers extended services for directly accessing unstructured data
within operating system files that are now bundled--as opposed to
sold separately--with the base server".
This sounds like the Content Management option that's currently
available (for a price) with ASE 12.5. But I can't find any
mention of this functionality in the ASE 15 docs. If ASE 15
can indeed query data in flat files, where can I find more
information on how to use this feature?
Michael Heaney
TIGR
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| Rob Verschoor 2005-09-27, 8:24 pm |
| This is the ASE_XFS option, that lets you access files and directories
through proxy tables. For more info, check out the details of the 'create
proxy_table command'.
ASE_XFS (and ASE_XML, ASE_WEBSERVICES and ASE_JAVA) are included in the
core ASE 15 product.
HTH,
Rob
-------------------------------------------------------------
Rob Verschoor
Certified Sybase Professional DBA for ASE 12.5/12.0/11.5/11.0
and Replication Server 12.5 / TeamSybase
Author of Sybase books (order online at www.sypron.nl/shop):
"Tips, Tricks & Recipes for Sybase ASE"
"The Complete Sybase Replication Server Quick Reference Guide"
"The Complete Sybase ASE Quick Reference Guide"
mailto:rob@YOUR.SPAM.sypron.nl.NOT.FOR.ME
http://www.sypron.nl
Sypron B.V., P.O.Box 10695, 2501HR Den Haag, The Netherlands
-------------------------------------------------------------
"Michael Heaney" <mheaney@tigr.org> wrote in message
news:4339b3d9$1@foru
ms-1-dub...
> eWeek has a story about ASE 15 in the 9/12/2005 edition, entitled
> "Latest Sybase ASE grows up". Towards the end is this: "The database
> offers extended services for directly accessing unstructured data
> within operating system files that are now bundled--as opposed to
> sold separately--with the base server".
>
> This sounds like the Content Management option that's currently
> available (for a price) with ASE 12.5. But I can't find any
> mention of this functionality in the ASE 15 docs. If ASE 15
> can indeed query data in flat files, where can I find more
> information on how to use this feature?
>
>
> Michael Heaney
> TIGR
| |
| Michael Heaney 2005-09-28, 11:24 am |
| Rob Verschoor wrote:
> This is the ASE_XFS option, that lets you access files and directories
> through proxy tables. For more info, check out the details of the 'create
> proxy_table command'.
> ASE_XFS (and ASE_XML, ASE_WEBSERVICES and ASE_JAVA) are included in the
> core ASE 15 product.
Thanks, Rob - very useful information. I'm at a loss to
understand why Sybase isn't making this more widely known.
Even a mention in the 'What's New in ASE 15' doc would
have been helpful, rather than (as far as I can tell)
just the ASE 15 matrix:
http://www.sybase.com/detail?id=1037459
So Java, XML and Web services are now bundled for free.
But the matrix indicates that the much-touted data
partitions capability is not bundled, but instead is
an extra-cost option. Is this true?
Michael Heaney
TIGR
| |
| Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase] 2005-09-28, 8:25 pm |
| Michael Heaney wrote:
> Rob Verschoor wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Thanks, Rob - very useful information. I'm at a loss to
> understand why Sybase isn't making this more widely known.
> Even a mention in the 'What's New in ASE 15' doc would
> have been helpful, rather than (as far as I can tell)
> just the ASE 15 matrix:
>
> http://www.sybase.com/detail?id=1037459
>
> So Java, XML and Web services are now bundled for free.
> But the matrix indicates that the much-touted data
> partitions capability is not bundled, but instead is
> an extra-cost option. Is this true?
>
>
> Michael Heaney
> TIGR
Hi Michael,
I can't think of any reason to use this feature in a production
environment. A better option would be to retrieve the file via sftp or
similar. IMHO
--
Jason L. Froebe
"There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
Jason L. Froebe
WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Rob Verschoor 2005-09-28, 8:25 pm |
|
"Michael Heaney" <mheaney@tigr.org> wrote in message
news:433ab99c$1@foru
ms-2-dub...
> Rob Verschoor wrote:
'create[color=darkre
d]
>
>
> Thanks, Rob - very useful information. I'm at a loss to
> understand why Sybase isn't making this more widely known.
> Even a mention in the 'What's New in ASE 15' doc would
> have been helpful, rather than (as far as I can tell)
> just the ASE 15 matrix:
>
> http://www.sybase.com/detail?id=1037459
>
> So Java, XML and Web services are now bundled for free.
> But the matrix indicates that the much-touted data
> partitions capability is not bundled, but instead is
> an extra-cost option. Is this true?
>
>
> Michael Heaney
> TIGR
Correct. Semantic partitioning is a licensable option (and so is the new
column encryption feature, BTW).
Rob V.
| |
| David Wein 2005-09-29, 9:24 am |
| What about a document management scenario where you don't want to store
various doc types (.doc, .ppt. .pdf, .ps, etc.) in image columns. You can
create a proxy table to them out on the file system, stored related metadata
in ASE, then use the verity engine to build a text index from the content on
the file system. A document search web app can then return results in the
form of hyperlinks to the documents using the file location from the proxy
table.
-Dave
"Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase]" <jfroebe@froebe.net> wrote in message
news:433af238$1@foru
ms-1-dub...
> Michael Heaney wrote:
'create[color=darkre
d]
the[color=darkred]
>
> Hi Michael,
>
> I can't think of any reason to use this feature in a production
> environment. A better option would be to retrieve the file via sftp or
> similar. IMHO
>
> --
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> "There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
> balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
>
> TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
> ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
> Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase] 2005-09-29, 1:24 pm |
| David Wein wrote:
> What about a document management scenario where you don't want to store
> various doc types (.doc, .ppt. .pdf, .ps, etc.) in image columns. You can
> create a proxy table to them out on the file system, stored related metadata
> in ASE, then use the verity engine to build a text index from the content on
> the file system. A document search web app can then return results in the
> form of hyperlinks to the documents using the file location from the proxy
> table.
>
> -Dave
A ftp or webserver would carry a far less of an overhead for serving
files than ASE would be and far less expensive. I'm still at a loss as
to what benefit the ASE XFS provides that warrants purchasing the
option. I'm sorry but I'm scratching my head over the usefulness of the
addon in a production environment.
--
Jason L. Froebe
"There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
Jason L. Froebe
WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Rob Verschoor 2005-09-29, 8:24 pm |
| An often-mentioned application is importing/exporting XML documents to/from
files.
HTH,
Rob V.
"Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase]" <jfroebe@froebe.net> wrote in message
news:433c2986$1@foru
ms-2-dub...
> David Wein wrote:
can[color=darkred]
metadata[color=darkr
ed]
content on[color=darkred]
the[color=darkred]
proxy[color=darkred]
>
> A ftp or webserver would carry a far less of an overhead for serving
> files than ASE would be and far less expensive. I'm still at a loss as
> to what benefit the ASE XFS provides that warrants purchasing the
> option. I'm sorry but I'm scratching my head over the usefulness of the
> addon in a production environment.
>
> --
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> "There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
> balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
>
> TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
> ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
> Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase] 2005-09-29, 8:24 pm |
| Rob Verschoor wrote:
> An often-mentioned application is importing/exporting XML documents to/from
> files.
>
> HTH,
>
> Rob V.
Even that isn't enough to justify purchasing ASE XFS option. How can I
justify it to management? The storing/retrieving/processing of XML
documents are better left to application and/or SOAP based servers.
What benefit does the ASE XFS option have over other solutions?
--
Jason L. Froebe
"There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
Jason L. Froebe
WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Michael Peppler 2005-09-30, 9:23 am |
| On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:10:03 -0700, Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase] wrote:
> Rob Verschoor wrote:
>
> Even that isn't enough to justify purchasing ASE XFS option. How can I
> justify it to management?
The point made earlier in the thread is that ASE XFS is now part of the
core license, so no need to justify the cost to management...
I agree in general with your comments, but remember about TMTOWTDI. Some
environments with different sets of competences for development might
prefer to see everything as a table and access it via SQL.
Michael
--
Michael Peppler [TeamSybase] mpeppler@peppler.org - http://www.peppler.org/
Sybase DBA/Developer
Sybase on Linux FAQ: http://www.peppler.org/FAQ/linux.html
| |
| David Wein 2005-09-30, 9:24 am |
| The point is that you are using ftp / webserver to serve the files. You are
using ASE to retrieve the file location based on some metadata you have
built and the end user has queried for. You code that builds the results
page would take the file location returned by ASE and massage it into a URL.
The benefit is that the verity text engine can read the file contents from
the proxy table and build a text index that can then be queried in ASE.
-Dave
"Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase]" <jfroebe@froebe.net> wrote in message
news:433c2986$1@foru
ms-2-dub...
> David Wein wrote:
can[color=darkred]
metadata[color=darkr
ed]
content on[color=darkred]
the[color=darkred]
proxy[color=darkred]
>
> A ftp or webserver would carry a far less of an overhead for serving
> files than ASE would be and far less expensive. I'm still at a loss as
> to what benefit the ASE XFS provides that warrants purchasing the
> option. I'm sorry but I'm scratching my head over the usefulness of the
> addon in a production environment.
>
> --
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> "There is usually a balance between the left and the right... checks &
> balances... the bane of the government but the boon of the people" -
> Jason L. Froebe
>
> WebBlog http://jfroebe.livejournal.com
>
> TeamSybase (http://www.teamsybase.com)
> ISUG member (http://www.isug.com)
> Chicago Sybase Tools User Group (http://www.cpbug.com)
| |
| Pablo Sanchez 2005-10-27, 8:21 am |
| "Jason L. Froebe [Team Sybase]" <jfroebe@froebe.net> wrote in
news:433c65c5$1@foru
ms-2-dub:
> Even that isn't enough to justify purchasing ASE XFS option. How
> can I justify it to management? The storing/retrieving/processing
> of XML documents are better left to application and/or SOAP based
> servers.
>
> What benefit does the ASE XFS option have over other solutions?
Some of the basic tenets Date mentions in An Introduction to
Databases (Third Edition, 1.3) are applicable:
* Security restrictions can be applied, and
* Integrity can be maintained.
Cheers,
--
Pablo Sanchez - Blueoak Database Engineering, Inc
http://www.blueoakdb.com
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